Rule Change for Big Water Tournaments

[AndrewShufelt]

I would love to see our Pro/Ams get even more support next season. I looked over the numbers of many of the past big water tournaments (Lake Ontario, Simcoe, St. Lawrence) and I think my idea is going to stir up some interest. Don't get me wrong, the current big water tournaments are great, love them but we can make them even better.

For big water tournaments, there would be a lot more interest if the largemouth were more of a factor. Right now if you fish for largies at the Kingston Open for example, you are fishing for 20th place.

What if the rules changed to 6 largemouth or 5 smallmouth. Mixed bags would be 5 fish only. Guys targeting largemouth would still be at a disadvantage, but much less so especially in multi-day events. Boaters would certainly increase and so to would non-boaters. In talking to my non-boaters from the Kingston Open the last three years, they really get a pounding on the water and only the hard core make it back the following year.

I am not suggesting this rule change for inland lakes like Rice or Tri-lakes just big waters.

What do you guys think? Yeah or nay?

[Colin Friel]

Nay... Interesting concept though.

[JustinPatterson]

I actually like this idea. It may attract more boaters and non-boaters. But I have little knowledge of the water so Im just an outsider looking in. That being said if that was an idea turned real I'd be interested. So it may not be a doable thing but you have a great idea and I think your on to something. IMHO.

[JohnWhyte]

I don't see how you could separate species because often there is a mixed bag. There is a lot of very large green ones in the area but very few want to fish for them. There has been several bags of largemouth over the last 4 years that were in the top 5 of the day.

The reason many of the AM's only come once is because for many it is a trip of a lifetime. It is expensive if you don't live in the area. Next years two locations and reduced cost should make a big difference.

This years event was the best yet after some fine tuning from previous years so you have to be careful about what you change. The organizers including Shimano and the CSFL do seem to have a very good grasp of what is working and what isn't.

[Peter Bartonek]

What's working and what isn't......
Berkley B1 Event at 155+ boats.....Canadian Open 56 boats
Pro Ams have just never been the deal here, but some still insist on putting that round peg in the square hole.

[KurtHehlJr]

I think new formats keep things interesting... Good to hear some new ideas, but ultimatley I believe anglers have grown to expect certain criteria for fishing these events as is. If the tournament doesnt fit in an anglers wheelhouse, then we all seem to find one that best suits our competitive wants. So damned expensive in the last few years though for travel costs.

[AricStoner]

I don't know if I like the idea of adding 1 fish for greenbacks, everyone has the opportunity to fish for one or the other and you and you alone should have to bear the responsibility of catching your best 5 if you choose to fish for the species that is known to have less #'s of big ones. There shouldn't be special treatment just because your species isn't known to grow as large as the other on the body of water you're fishing.

That being said, what about mandatory mixeed bags? 2 of each and your 3rd is a wildcard?

As for format of events, I think that Team Tourneys seem to be the way to go because there is just so much choice right now. But I think there is a nieche for all formats.

Team Events - Localized / Regional Qualifiers and 1 off annual events (IE BPS Open & B1 etc). Both draw good numbers depending on the organizing body and are well received by the majority of anglers as the bread and butter events they typically fish.

Pro-Am’s - Good stage to showcase top level anglers while giving newbys the opportunity to learn and get their feet wet into tournaments.

Angler / Co-Angler - CBAF & OBF Qualifiers from what I’ve heard are both very well run and highly participated. But yet I keep getting told that this format won’t fly in Ontario? Unless I am mistaken I don’t think that anyone outside of these grassroots Federations has attempted it so there is really is very little backing to say that it won’t work.

Lots of room to play around with these events also, you can make it a top level prestigious event like the Kingston Open, or you can make them inexpensive localized Divisional Qualifiers towards a Regional or National Championship similar to the BFL - Regional - All American - FLW CUP hierarchy.

Like I said I think there’s room for all 3 format’s, it’s just a matter of to what end or extent? That’s up to the organizers though. We can suggest, but they are the ones who have to make the decisions on this, a task that I don’t at all envy!

[JohnWhyte]

What's working and what isn't......
Berkley B1 Event at 155+ boats.....Canadian Open 56 boats
Pro Ams have just never been the deal here, but some still insist on putting that round peg in the square hole.

There is a huge difference in cost between the B1 and the Canadian Open. The entry cost per boat for the B1 is $600.00 but the entry for the Canadian Open is $1750.00 (pro$1000.00 am $750.00). The Canadian Open has twice the payout per person at 100 boats. I believe now that the event is going to be two days and the entry cost is lower you will find it will sell out very quick. If I had my choice I would just fish pro-ams.

[PaulLegacey]

As an AM that has fished the Open for the past 4 years and fished with some amazing people, I have had the opportunity to fish large mouth only days with my Pros and thoroughly enjoyed it. Honestly, they've said to me "we won't get the weight that the smallies may produce but have a chance if they shut down!" which is very true being that there are some unbelievable lm spots around Kingston and smallies are finicky.

I do think maybe looking at segregating the 2 types maybe of interest to some and beneficial as it may draw in those that know the river and large mouth fishing more that small mouth.

I know a lot of people that fish largies only and if it were changed, would be more interested in entering the Open.

Cheers

[jamiekennedy]

Just wondering about the 2 day event at split locations next year and reduced costs. John can you provide a little more info on Where and How much if you know of these details? 1st I have heard of the change points for next season.
Thanks in advance.
JK

[Aaron-Hathaway]

I disagree with the idea. Kingston open is stiveing to be the top level professional tourny in ontario/canada and with that said is most likley hoping to draw the best of the best anglers to show case their events and fisheries. To be the best you must beat the best and if that means going out of your confort zone well that just part of the game at the top level. We never hear KVD complian that he has to go to florida and flipp for largies and ya never hear Denny Brauer complain when he has to go smallie fishin on St.clair.

[KRISWIITA]

I disagree with the idea. Kingston open is stiveing to be the top level professional tourny in ontario/canada and with that said is most likley hoping to draw the best of the best anglers to show case their events and fisheries. To be the best you must beat the best and if that means going out of your confort zone well that just part of the game at the top level. We never hear KVD complian that he has to go to florida and flipp for largies and ya never hear Denny Brauer complain when he has to go smallie fishin on St.clair.

Thats because Denny is retired..LMAO --just teasing but I hear ya !

[JoeyTurk]

I fished the Kingston open as an AM its first two years, (2010 and 2011) and I was very fortunate to draw some incredible anglers, John Whyte and Andrew Shufelt being a couple of them. Actually the day I was supposed to fish with Andrew, high winds and rough waters kicked in and the day was actually cancelled prior to launching. Andrew still wanting to fish, planned to head to another inland lake for the day, and invited me along. Something he didn't have to do...and something I was grateful for.
I truly enjoyed fishing the event both years and was fortunate enough to place high in the AM standings, and both years i walked away with some great prizes.
Unfortunately, while I would have loved to fish it again, ( every year), it is an expensive week when you add it all up. It also requires time away from work, and time away from the family.
Personally, if it were an event that happened every second or third year, I'd probably be in every time. But its tough to commit to it every year for the reasons mentioned above.
I most certainly plan on fishing it again at some point as I think its a fantastic event. I've learned more in those 6 days of fishing then I would have fishing an entire season on my own.

[AricStoner]

I disagree with the idea. Kingston open is stiveing to be the top level professional tourny in ontario/canada and with that said is most likley hoping to draw the best of the best anglers to show case their events and fisheries. To be the best you must beat the best and if that means going out of your confort zone well that just part of the game at the top level. We never hear KVD complian that he has to go to florida and flipp for largies and ya never hear Denny Brauer complain when he has to go smallie fishin on St.clair.

Alltough Denny did complain when JVD flipped for his Largies!... lol

[JohnWhyte]

Just wondering about the 2 day event at split locations next year and reduced costs. John can you provide a little more info on Where and How much if you know of these details? 1st I have heard of the change points for next season.
Thanks in advance.
JK

I'm not sure if it's carved in stone yet but the second tournament will be mid Aug. on Simcoe out of Barrie. I believe the Kingston Canadian Open will be the same dates but reduced to two days. I also believe the pro entry will be $750 or $800 and the AM side will be $600.00. I could certainly be corrected but these are the numbers I'm seeing.

If you want to fish the Simcoe Canadian Open the first spots will be reserved for those that fished the Kingston Open. There actually was a press release about this so I'll try and find it for more details if there is anyone.

Thanks for the reminder to get my cheque in now and reserve my position